Brian Wilson as a Beatle rival

by **Chris Speers** » Wed Dec 04, 2002 10:26 pm

Brian Wilson doesn't get enough credit. Here is a man who had pure genius in his talent. Don't forget - this is a man (Brian WIlson) who had to fight his record company, his daddy, his own group to put out the music that he knew was pure genius. And for his time period ('64-'67) Brian Wilson put out some of the greatest songs in the history of music. And don't forget - he virtually did it alone. Remember, the Beatles had a huge advantage over Brian Wilson. First of all, they had a creative team of two guys (Lennon-McCartney) over his one. Second, they had George Martin and the record company had their back. And despite these odds, Brian Wilson had "game" and up to a certain point - he held his own against the group. He was innovative, Brilliant, and most of all - a huge influence on the Beatles (The bass playing on Pet sounds, the harmonies, the use of instruments). Brian Wilson deserves his props - The dude is a genius.

But, you have to give it to the Beatles - they wiped the floor with him and every other person in the 60's. They were just too damn innovative

by **Chris Speers** » Wed Dec 04, 2002 10:26 pm

Brian Wilson doesn't get enough credit. Here is a man who had pure genius in his talent. Don't forget - this is a man (Brian WIlson) who had to fight his record company, his daddy, his own group to put out the music that he knew was pure genius. And for his time period ('64-'67) Brian Wilson put out some of the greatest songs in the history of music. And don't forget - he virtually did it alone. Remember, the Beatles had a huge advantage over Brian Wilson. First of all, they had a creative team of two guys (Lennon-McCartney) over his one. Second, they had George Martin and the record company had their back. And despite these odds, Brian Wilson had "game" and up to a certain point - he held his own against the group. He was innovative, Brilliant, and most of all - a huge influence on the Beatles (The bass playing on Pet sounds, the harmonies, the use of instruments). Brian Wilson deserves his props - The dude is a genius.

But, you have to give it to the Beatles - they wiped the floor with him and every other person in the 60's. They were just too damn innovative

by **Steve-o** » Wed Dec 04, 2002 10:32 pm

I agree---to witness it first hand at the time was awesome. Every hard-core fan of both groups at the time could feel the friendly competition and HUGE mutual respect and were very aware of it. It was like a heavyweight fight---Ali-Frazier. My uncle was a huge BW fan, and I was more into the Beatles, but loved and always have loved Brian.

by **Ram1** » Wed Dec 04, 2002 10:52 pm

Yeah, Paul has admitted that BW's bass playing was a HUGE influence on him. And you can really tell, especially around '65-'66. Paul's bass playing became much more elaborate. I think to this day, from interviews and things I've heard, Brian is still really upset and jealous about Sgt. Pepper. Pet Sounds was HIS Pepper. He set out to make the best album ever. And then...BAM...Pepper is released. It was much more than just friendly competition. BW was emotionally crushed. Smile definitely could have rivalved Pepper, (I have some of the "lost" Smile recordings), but IMHO, Pepper still comes out on top. But Pet Sounds/Smile are definitely the closest thing to Pepper there probably ever was. Some of the ideas on Smile are just amazing. And of course, Pet Sounds...well...enough said. But as much as people talk about Pet Sounds and stuff, a lot of the earlier work is taken for granted. I mean, early songs like 'I Get Around' are just pure pop genius. And 'Don't Worry Baby', oh man, talk about giving me chills. AWESOME. Thanks, Chris. I think I'm gonna slip on some Beach Boys tonight.

by **Chris Speers** » Wed Dec 04, 2002 11:39 pm

I'll put "Warmth of the Sun" and "Don't worry baby" up against the best Beatle tracks pre-1964 and i mean it. Those songs are pure magic and Brian was just 21 when he wrote those classics.

I have an acapella version of just "Wouldn't it be nice" - and it's the most amazing thing. That and "You still believe in me" is just pure magic.

It's sad the way Mike Love has "bastardized" the Beach Boys legacy

by **Ram1** » Wed Dec 04, 2002 11:45 pm

Chris, I totally agree with you. 'Warmth of the Sun' is SUPERB. And 'You Still Believe in Me' is just simply amazing. And yeah, I lost a lot of respect for Mike Love when I found out he was the main one who was against BW's musical "experimentation." He wanted to "stick with the formula" and continue to write surf tunes. He didn't understand or respect Brian's vision.

by **Brains** » Thu Dec 05, 2002 9:59 am

First I only knew the 'surf' Beach Boys. Then I bought Pet Sounds, 'cause I couldn't believe these surf pop dudes could make an album that could rival Pepper.

Well, I guess they (or better: BW) could. If Mike Love wanted to stick to the formula and could not recognise BW's genius... yes, that makes me lose a lot of respect for him (musically).

Was Pepper the thing that made BW lose his marbles, or did he have issues before that?

by **Chris Speers** » Thu Dec 05, 2002 11:40 am

He had issues before Pepper but Pepper drove him over the edge, bro. Paul actually showed up during Smile sessions and spooked him by doing She's leaving home and really driving Wilson's paraonia to an extreme.

by **Ram1** » Thu Dec 05, 2002 11:49 am

Are you sure about that, Chris? I heard that Paul actually visited the Beach Boys in the studio in England during the PET SOUNDS sessions. And that he was so impressed by what was going on, that that was one of his major inspirations for Pepper.

by **Chris Speers** » Thu Dec 05, 2002 12:07 pm

In the Oobu Joobu radio show, Brian says Paul appeared in LA during Smile sessions and played him a new song called "She's Leaving Home"
- it must have been around April 1967 when he did the Magical Mystery Tour idea on the plane back. He was visiting Jane Asher at the time i believe. I'm pretty sure Paul was in LA in April 1967 because Pepper was in the can by then.

I don't know about the visit during Pet Sounds - it wouldn't surprise me that he did visit Brian in 1966 during a tour or something. I know that the Beatles were given acetates of Pet Sounds in April - May 1966 by Carl Wilson and some of the guys from the Beach Boys who were touring and they were knocked out by it.