::Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band

[Lazarus_2]

Absolutely, James. He felt sidelined and and as if he didn't really have a role during the Pepper sessions. According to G. Martin, George would spend hours (e.g. on the title track) carefully, meticulously, methodically and painstakingly working out every note of a solo. Then, later in the session, Macca would wipe it all and come up with a pithy, inventive solo in seconds to replace George's. While it's easy to feel sorry for George, Paul was so adept at thinking up musical brilliance on the spur of the moment.
There was, of course, a precedence for great Macca solos and lead guitar flourishes, e.g. The Night Before: Macca
Ticket To Ride: all Macca lead guitar
Another Girl: Macca lead guitar
Michelle: lead guitar solo (he actually used a bass to get that sound)
Taxman: solo.
So, it's hardly surprising that Macca went on to perform most of the lead guitar work on an album that was, in effect, very much HIS baby.

I have yet to see Macca put as much energy into a solo project, as he did with Sgt.pepper.

Mabye his next album can be "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Man"..

I don´t think it is a easy as that. I think Macca tries his best every time he records e new record.

That's not what macca said...(i think i read it somewhere),
this is the first time he actually set-out to make a good record(CACITB), which resulted in his best album IMO.

[Mini]

Note sure if there are any Brian Wilson fans here but if you look at the progression and influence you have Rubber Soul come out and then Brian comes up with Pet Sounds which is hailed as a masterpiece.

In the meantime the Beatles work on Revolver which imo sowed alot of the seeds that became Pepper.

Paul is amazed and wants to beat it (Pet Sounds) and hence Pepper is born. It's interesting that Revolver didn't receive it's dues until the last 10 years or so and now frequently tops Greatest Album polls.

After listening to Pet Sounds and then Pepper I'm not so enamoured with it as much I used to. You can actually see that Paul was competing with Brian Wilson and that the Beatles weren't really trail blazing as such.

Brian uses a harpsichord so do the Beatles, Brian uses orchestration so do the Beatles etc..

It's probbaly the biggest and best rip-off ....Influence on Pepper was the use of the Bass Harmonicas which Paul attributed to the Variety Show he watched when he was a kid or whatever. It just so happens that Brian uses them in over 50% of Pet Sounds.As you continue to listen you see that Pepper may be the biggest rip-off of Pet Sounds that was ever made (and there have been many).

If the public EXPECTED that kind of music from the Beach Boys, Pet Sounds would be voted as the Best Album of all time in many polls....However since the public and the media expected "surf music" from the Beach Boys it was dismissed in many circles.

Look at this comparison.

The Beach Boys released these albums
Summer Days and Summer Nights (June 1965)
Beach Boys Party (November 1965)
and THEN
Pet Sounds (May 1966)

The change of musical style is like night and day between the previous two and Pet Sounds.

The Beatles on the other hand as we know (and I will use the UK versions for this purpose) release
Rubber Soul
Revolver
and then
Pepper

the evolution is way more normal and you can see where they were headed..But the difference is ..They HEARD Pet Sounds and made thier version of it. Since it was what was expected. (as there was a huge gap between Revolver and Pepper).Pepper had two things going for it
It was the Beatles!!
And People were DYING for a new Beatles album.
So Sgt Pet Sounds was born.

[RickStark79]

I don't think that people hail Sgt. Peppers as better than Pet Sounds because it was expected by them. Expectations are what kill good albums.

You're right, the evolution for the Beatles was normal, but I don't think anyone ever expected Pepper. It was their next step from Revolver, which was the next step from Rubber Soul, but it was like nothing ever heard before. You can compare Pet Sounds to Rubber Soul and Revolver, but it's nowhere near the progression of Sgt. Peppers.

You mention the Beach Boys progression from Summer Days and Summer Nights, then Beach Boys Party to Pet Sounds. I think Pet Sounds is a bigger rip-off of Rubber Soul than Pepper was of Pet Sounds. You already saw that progress from The Beatles, you didn't see it from The Beach Boys until after Rubber Soul came out. You don't jump from Barbara Ann to Wouldn't It Be Nice without some big influence!

[james1985]

Just been listening to When I'm Sixty Four a lot and it amazes me how well arranged the song is. It's incredible how the clarinet, oboe and piano just drop in and out, and never ever outstay their welcome. And when George's guitar just chime in right at the end, a great piece of understated guitar playing.

[EddieV]

Hey James

99% of the Beatles are well arranged thanks to George Martin.

[jason]

i really wonder how much george played with the arrangements of their instruments, like i doubt that the chimey guitar that's referred to was martin saying, "come in right there, it'll be great" the beatles were extremely creative, look at harrison's all things.... album - spector is given credit but george has stated that phil was out to lunch on a lot of it and he did it himself.
I agree with lennon, sgt pepper really a collection of songs that have nothing to do with each other. and i think not the best of the beatles

[jason]

probably an old discussion here, but i'm new to the board. I love both groups , but what brian wilson did was giftedness at its peak, what the beatles did with pepper was collaboration at its peak. The songs on pet sounds are so much more introspective than pepper, i wonder if that is what turns people off of ranking it higher than pepper, pepper's songs might have more entertainment value (some of them anyway)

[Lazarus_2]

Hey James

99% of the Beatles are well arranged thanks to George Martin.

um, it was a collaborative arrangements.

[Lazarus_2]

i really wonder how much george played with the arrangements of their instruments, like i doubt that the chimey guitar that's referred to was martin saying, "come in right there, it'll be great" the beatles were extremely creative, look at harrison's all things.... album - spector is given credit but george has stated that phil was out to lunch on a lot of it and he did it himself.
I agree with lennon, sgt pepper really a collection of songs that have nothing to do with each other. and i think not the best of the beatles

lol!

have you heard the bass on pepper?

[Bluebird]

The bassline on "Getting better" is one of my favourites of all their songs. Melodicly it´s superb.